Nov. 16, 2022

Jack and Diane (John Cougar Mellencamp) w Dave Barnes - Episode 1015

Jack and Diane (John Cougar Mellencamp) w Dave Barnes - Episode 1015

An American classic song deserves and American classic guest, so we had to bring in the big guns--Uncle Dave Barnes returns to the third man chair to help us break down the John Cougar Mellencamp stalwart, "Jack and Diane." We'll break down the song into its best and funniest bits, and get into our usual shenanigans, which are even more shenanigany than usual with Dave in the room. Plus:

- Hot Takes!

- “Everything is singable.”

- The “Weird Al” Yankovic parody that almost was

-  Minds are blown about the structure of the song

Enjoy, and thanks so much for being a Producer!

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Get tickets to see Dave's Christmas show and his tour with Lady A here!

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Patreon Producers: Andrea Konarzewski, Brad Callahan, Ari Marucci, Michael Conley, Peter Mark Campbell, David Steinberg, Randy Hodge, Chaz Bacus, Juan Lopez, Jason Arrowood, Howard Passey, Micah Murphy, Tim Jahr

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Transcript

(This transcript is provided by cute little baby robots, so it may be imperfect. But adorable!)

[00:00:00] Turn out the radio and sing all along. It's time for another great song. This is the Great Song Podcast. Seasons. Greetings, and welcome once again to the Great. Song. Podcast. I'm Rob Alley. I am J.P. Mosier, Yeah. And we're here to celebrate the greatest songs in modern music history. We're gonna tell you what makes 'em great, why we think they're awesome, and why you should too J.P, how you doing today, ma?

Man, I am doing fan. Fantastic. Okay, so we're here with Great. Song. Podcast favorite. Yeah, let's just call him honorary family members. Yes, at this point. Uncle Dave. Come on. Uncle Dave, David McKee Barn. Let's go folks. Here we go. That that, You guys have got that? Is it? Have y'all trademarked that whole first thing yet?

No, we should know that. Have you sent that to like the, you know, the Library of Congress and been like, It should definitely copyright it should definitely have one of those, the circle R's at the end. , You just can hear it now. You hear sort of a ding in the background. I actually, yesterday I brought up to J.P.

A tweak to the beginning. I said, No, absolutely not. Oh my gosh. Said [00:01:00] it's too many. I say it to myself, to my wife. I do all parts. I do Rob's part, I do my part, and she's like, Quit doing that. I'm like, It just, How many, how many episodes now? 200 plus. By the time we, This one will be episode 2 24. Good. So you're just shy.

2 25. Okay. Maybe we'll push you back and make you 2 25. I don't know. Yeah. I appreciate that. I appreciate that. You're 2 24. Yeah, five years. 10 seasons, 200 plus episodes night. Guys. We're rolling. We love this stuff. Love it. That's amazing. Welcome Dave. Okay, so we can't have Dave on and not do some takes.

Yeah. Though he's been kind enough to sacrifice one from, from the fold. So let's quickly, let's reset for anybody who is, this is your first episode, Dave Barnes. Is. A, how about this? A 5 million plus selling songwriter God gave me. You just hit 5 million. Did you see in the picture that it said gold gave me?

No, it did not. I just thought, what a wonderful, like God just being like, No, bro. No, no, no. We gotta keep this bar real low. Wow. Yeah. I got [00:02:00] home from that ceremony. It was really sweet. I mean, those are those nights where you kind of feel like, yeah, yeah, you pinch yourself. Right? But I got home and I, you know, I was like, I wanna tweet about this really cool moment and cuz you wanna be careful about not being the guys, like all poses win, win, win.

But I was like, it's get cool. I mean it's 5 million, you know? Yes. That's downloads that the guy gave me that. Yeah. With Blake and so, I, I did it and I sent it to thinking about it and the next morning, my kid, which is, that's a, Then later that day I got more dms about it, but my kid was like, Why does it say Gold gave me you?

And I was like, Of course it says Gold gave me, I could just hear Jesus laughing. You know, I remember we had Dave on for episode 100. Yeah. And so the way you are with your 5 million we're like, We got Dave Barnes. Yeah. Seriously, that was us. Like, Yeah. Yeah. And then since then, so yeah, so that's, Dave is a, a seriously multi-platinum songwriter, fantastic artist, humanitarian lover , I don't know all that person of his own podcaster of, [00:03:00] So now you're over a hundred episodes on Daville.

Yeah. Right? Yeah. And you're in season two of Dave's five Hot Takes. Which is where we get the hot takes. We like to we like to add to that, what we can. And we got the, the honor of being on your, on your show in the first season. That's still one of my favorite episodes. And it was so much fun. So now we just keep a running list of hot takes too, just cuz it's fun.

Fun. Well, we'll just have you back on to do, like, to do redo Easy sell on that. Okay. Do you find now that there is like a hot Takes c. That Like people all the time now are like, well people, Well, what's really sweet is a girl sent me one. She was like, I really want you to do Hot Takes on Sister Christian.

Okay. Night Ranger. And I was, and I, it was funny cuz you know, a lot of times those, they'll make like, you get one, you're like, Oh, of course we do on that. But I, so I started running the song in my head and I was like, there's just, I mean, it is a bizarre song, but there was nothing. I was like, What? That is weird.

But there's nothing stuck out enough that I'd be like, So I texted her back and I'm ding her back. I was like, That's awesome. Tell me why the, why the [00:04:00] fascination. And she actually was very articulate. She's like, Well, I did a deep dive. And she's like, I found out that like it's written by their drummer.

She said, What actually makes a lot of sense to me? Cuz some of it just doesn't make sense. It feels like a drummer, right? Sounds like a drummer. Yeah. But, but then, but, but I think all I'd say what I like the most is it's almost, in some ways I feel like it's helped people. Learn how to think about songs or go, or like that girl going, I did a deep dive.

Yeah. Cause I thought this song just sounds weird. And then she figured out like, oh, the drummer wrote it. And maybe that's why it sounds weird. So you almost feel like a proud parent. I love it. I get, cuz I had a family moment like that, that my wife actually, and we may have to edit this out, but she tweeted the, Oh Carol, the 1975 thing the other day.

And then you texted, I'm like, Look, I was like, he agreed. That's crazy. That's awesome. And I've had random other friends text me about that song. Yeah. Isn't that weird? Isn't it weird? Yeah. Because it's like if we're, we're talking about O Caroline on the new 1975 album has got major league dreaming electric blue vibes.

I know, of course. I'm like, [00:05:00] well, two, I had two opposing thoughts. Like there's no way in the world this guy knows his song. And then slash like, how great would it be if he's inspired if I found out? Like, he's like, Yeah, I just heard your song. And I was like, That's a cool vibe. Yeah. And I. That's the coolest thing ever.

like that is a Trans-Atlantic High five. Right. And also if you were the, if you were the Martin Martin, if you were the Marvin Gay Estate, they would already be in court. Oh bro. Yeah. I'd already have them. Big time. You'd own them on I knuckled down on, Yeah. Yeah. Okay, so let's get started. We're each gonna do a hot take take in Dave's Honor me first.

Okay. You or Dave, When are you guys go for? Right? Alright, Dave, you wanna go first? No, y'all go first. Okay. Alright. Pool. Let's see. Okay. This is great. This is classic. This is a classic take for for us. Okay. You guys know the song, The one I love Back then by George Jones? She was hotter than a $2 pistol.

Okay. She ones the fastest thing around. Okay. Ready for this? The melody on the chorus, just within the chorus jumps two octaves and a third . My goodness. Let me, I'll play a little bit of it so you can hear it. It's, I [00:06:00] think we're in the key of D. Okay. Yeah. And we talked long, long, long ago about like how impossible the chorus just for friends and low places is.

Right. It's the low. The low is what will make this one. Yes, exactly. So friends and low places is like an octave and a fifth. But this is two octaves and a third. We're gonna go from a low low D to a high high F sharp. Okay. Ge, Let me find it. Hang on. I, I love the, what a lyric. She was hotter than a $2 pistol.

It's the brunett in your bed that turns me home. I had one that was hotter than a $2 pistol. She was the fastest. That's two octaves. Okay. And then he is gonna go, That's a, Yeah. the neighborhood that in St. George. Who knew Reagan? It was, I would tell you what, I feel like a lot of those old school country.

Like they were sneaky good singers. Yeah. There was, there was a time in music where you kind of had to be a good singer. Yeah. And I think that like they were, I feel like a lot of those guys sort of like took on [00:07:00] a personality or character uhhuh and like, this how I sing. But if you realize like, it's like tpa, remember how when everybody figured I'd sing, Oh, it feels like, Was he on the mask singer?

Didn't he come? He was. But like, you know, you, you kind of feel. They actually could sing. It's just like, they're like, This is kinda what I do to get the girls who come to the, you know, and then if you like made 'em go sing somewhere in N Anthem, you'd hear 'em be like, Wow, George Jones can like rip. I mean, George Jones could do someday by Mariah Care

whistle tones. George, it's hit him. Yes. That is amazing. Okay, I'll go next. Okay. I wanted to go in the middle because I'm gonna talk about the Middle by Jimi Eat Worlds Jimi. Okay. So y'all know the song, you're familiar quite a little bit. Okay, so Progression predominantly 1 5 41. Okay. So the changes happen in the middle.

Okay. Okay. The chorus hits on the second beat of the first bar. Yeah. It just takes, it just takes some time. [00:08:00] So that would. The middle, in the middle, be in the middle, blistering solo at minute 2 45 ish, I'm sorry, at minute one 30 of a 2 45 to three minute song, which is, Which is wow, in the middle. All the changes of the middle happen in the middle.

Wow. Because it's 1541. So you have ones on either side, ones on either. . That's great. That is an incredible hot table. So I was like playing. I was like, No, , No. Do they even know that, right? Or is it also, or, I mean, I'm not gonna knock Jim Atkins. That guy's great. I've seen him a lot of times, but he's not, I don't put him as the guy that's like, Let's do this.

I think that's an accidental take. That is awesome. With the title of that song, that's. Geez, that's like doctorate level . Every now and then I get one. That song has one of my favorite misheard lyrics. I had a friend that like, you know how sometimes you realize that like the whole time you've known a song, you've thought they were saying a [00:09:00] word that isn't even one word?

Yeah. Yeah. It's just a nonsense syllable. And so I had a friend that thought it was Take some time. Iha will. Beha Alga. Yeah. You, Which sounds like a prophets from the Old Testament for sure. That Saul went to go see to have his, the. Look at the sweet, look at the, what is it? So come both. So please do a Bible story where you're all the characters.

Like everyone. Yeah. That would be fun. For about 10 seconds. And everybody's like, he's taking this way too seriously. He's crying in character. Okay. He was a fun fact. So this is, this is a hot take, but it's also just kind of a fun fact. You guys may know this if you listen to How does it feel by Bob Dylan?

Yeah. Like a Rolling stone. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Yeah, yeah. Sorry. I know what you're talking about, but have you ever noticed that the organ is about a half half beat behind everybody else? No. No. The reason is this is amazing to me. Al [00:10:00] Cooper, who played Sure, went on to be famous for production and other things.

Snuck into playing the organ part and didn't know the chords snuck onto the session, so he had to wait until they played the chords. He would play shut mouth. Good job, Dave. That. How about that? I like that. Wow. You listen to it now, it'll mess your brain up. No, that's a good, Yeah, that was hanging out. Now you don't talk so loud.

Now you. Oh, seems so proud. That's a gutty. Isn't that amazing? I love that so much. Which is too, cuz it's kind of an iconic part. I mean, that organ part is such a big part of that song. Oh, how does he feel? You know, like, man, isn't that crazy? I wonder why he had to sneak in because he was so, the story goes sudden.

Like he was there and like was they, they didn't need him or something. Or he was on another session or something. And that's so awesome. He just was like, I'm [00:11:00] playing. And I, and I, I think he was there to play. I think he was at the time maybe known more for playing another instrument. And so I think even the organ was a little bit like, That's great.

I can't remember the, Yeah, but it's crazy's like Rolling Stone's. But guys, were not talking about like Rolling Stone today. We do wonder how it feels. Hey, set up a, But in classic J.P, Robin, Dave, fashion, we've talked for 42 minutes about other things. Rob, you wanna tell him? Song we're talking about today and jump right in.

Absolutely. I do. We've got a classic on deck for you today. This is Jack and Diane by John Cougar. I'm not gonna say his last name yet. . Oh, she's such a,

Man, the space in this song is so[00:12:00]

little duty about Jack. Two American kids growing up in the

heartlands.

Let's see on Chili, do I had to get through that second version? Had to get the second on chili. Do had to get second on chili. Do on Jackie's lap. Got his hands between knees. I'll probably, I'm gonna let it play through the course and then I'll figure out later how to condense the clip. Dribble those.

There's so much in this song lyrically to not understand . [00:13:00] What do you mean? Like to not be able to understand what he's saying. Just literally can't understand you without reading the lyric sheet. Yeah.

Right. Here we go. There we go. Coming out of it. Oh yeah, that's Jack and Diane by John Cougar, AKA John Mellencamp, A AKA Johnny Cougar. A a aka. John Cougar Mellencamp from the 1980 A A A A Cougar. He, he's gone by just Cougar. He had a Cougar album. Wow. Wow. Holy cow. At least he warned the women. Dang. From the 1982 album, American Fool, it went to number one on the billboard and US cash box charts, Number one on the mainstream rock number one in Canada, number seven in Australia, number 12 in South Africa, and number 25 in the uk.

It was number seven for all of 1982, and it is number 2 [00:14:00] 26 on the billboard all time. 600, come on. Oh wow. That's amazing. One below Kathy's Clown by the Everly Brothers and one above Jump by Van Halen. Oh, okay. You know, you know what's interesting? Quick aside. It's interesting that it did that well in the uk cuz this is a American song.

Very American. It's a, it it, which may have been like a pastis or some, you know, like a little moment they thought was cute because of it. Yeah. Like actually, you know, it came on the other day I was watching Dairy Girls, I don't know if you know that show, It's the funniest show on Netflix, but Life in a Northern Town came up.

Okay. And I was thinking, Yeah. And I was thinking which version? The original, the techno version. Oh goodness. Which, who knew that was even a thing? No, not, but I say all that to say this. It is interesting when you have these songs that are very much Local. Mm-hmm. or, or you know, they have a very, Yeah.

Regional, regional language. But they still translate. Yeah. Like in other countries. Yeah. So it's interesting to hear you say cuz you know, life in Northern Town was a big song in America. Yeah. But it's absolutely about northern uk. Yeah. It's well it originally wasn't [00:15:00] the, the, a uk I can't remember who did the original, I probably should have looked that up.

It's like dream the dream. It's something like that. But the, like you said, the little big town Sugarland, that version, that version blew up in America for a minute. But it's funny cuz you know, you would think, why would that work on in the uk? But actually, you know, you'd think in America like, well it should be huge in the uk.

Say no imagine some really, really niche English song. Yeah. That's talking very specifically about right English things. My neighborhood in leed. Yeah. Yeah. Like, you know, getting the chill, like to Tasty Free, you'd be like, what is it Tasty for? What would their names be if it was Jack and Diane, but written over there, I mean, I feel like maybe Diane would still be one of them.

Yeah, Diane would be there. Probably Jack also like, but J L E C K. J A C Q U. Oh. And, and if we're going, he's in French immigrant. Yeah. Let's see. Let me give. The number, the top 10 from 82. Cause this is quite a list that's this was number seven for all of 1982 and the top 10, he [00:16:00] actually has two songs in there.

Cougar does number seven is Jack and Diane. I'll give you the top eight. Eight is Hurt. So Good off the same album. Oh wow. Same album. Also with some clap. Big clap on both of these album. Both of these songs. Right. Number six is, Don't You Want Me By The Human League? Oh man. Number five is Centerfold by the Jay Giles Band, which I could have done a hot take.

The first time I ever really listened those lyrics was two days ago and I was like, Angel, this is a weird, weird, weird. Yeah. Did you see the thing where he burnt the lyric sheet online? That was Rick Springfield. Springfield. Jesse's girl. Got him confused. Nevermind. Yes, go ahead. He did a thing where he was like, I have, I'm holding here.

He was like in a studio and he had like a candle and. He's like, I just found the, my original handwritten lyrics to Jesse's girl. And why did he do that? I was talking, It catches on fire. I think it was set up. I think it just for a joke. It's a, it was convincing, you know, he's an actor, so like, but it was good.

He had me for a second, not gonna lie, he had me in the first half. Number five. Number number five is Centerfold, which Yes. Absolutely a weird song, right? Like we, like my memory has just been sold. Okay. Right. Well, the verses get even weird. It's like, I, I meant [00:17:00] to hot take and pull it up. Cause I was like, this would be a great hot take, but go, I digress.

Go ahead. Number four kind of surprises me, but I guess I don't think of this song as being as big as, obviously it was Ebony and Ivory, Paul McCartney to Wonder, I mean, big song. Number three, I love Rock and Roll, Joan Jet and The Black Hearts. Number two, I Tiger My Survivor. And number one, a song that consistently surprises me in its hugeness, and that would be physical by Olivia Newton John.

Okay. What It's like one of the, that melody is so good. That little half step movement. Oh my God. Yeah. This song is certified gold in the us which is surprising that it's only gold there. I don't, I don't believe that, you know, this is with the Spotify charts. Now, surely that thing is, Yeah, I don't know how that works.

Like the R I A A certifications and all that stuff. It's, it's platinum in Canada. Silver in the uk. But maybe it's just because the album was so big, you know? Maybe. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. That's not as many. That's fair. That's fair. 40 fives at that point going. Okay. A few listening notes from me real quick.

Did you see that was his only number one hit? Yes. Yeah, it's his, That's crazy. In a, you think Mellencamp, he's had obviously [00:18:00] several? No, just his, you know, only number one Bill. He kind of occupied a weird space though, because it's like, he was like sort of like pseudo country. Yeah. In rock. Yeah. So even though it's like, it's not that it makes sense because he should, I mean all those songs to me, I would've guessed number one small town.

I thought Small town was bigger than Pink Houses. Pink Houses, yeah. Cherry, like all that, you know? Yeah. Right. Is that what it's called? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I love that song. Absolutely. What a and weird fiddle part. The, that woman, you're like, Oh, there's a woman singing now Wild Knights. He, it's like, you know, he is, he is the Midwest answer to Bruce Springsteen.

Yeah. Right. I mean, he is, I saw they did a song together like. Oh, last month. Oh, that's great. And the video was really sweet. They're like sitting in a driveway playing and it was like, Oh, those guys, , God, save them. I fight authority. Authority with him. Right. 30 song. Oh yeah. 30. Oh yes. That's weird. I heard such a different melody and [00:19:00]rhythm than what you were singing.

Oh, wow. Like that melody and I No, no, no. It was just, it went to a different place in my brain and I had no idea what you were singing. You thought it started on the two instead of the one kind of thing. Yeah. And yeah. No, but he's, he's an interesting case study to me. Melancamp. Cuz he feels ubiquitous to me.

Like he feels like he's everywhere and his career's massive. Yeah. Cause it is, but. There, it, it, it like, you start sort of going, well hold on. What are the songs? And they're big songs, but they're not necessarily Springsteen big. Yeah. And then you start going, Oh not that it makes sense. He would only have a number one cuz it's, again, I think he is an insanely good song.

But I think my, my recollection of him maybe misguided in what he actually was in the zeitgeist. Yeah. Because he is a very unique. You know, again, he was like, pseudo country pop. Yeah. Which you could see how the world might have been like, No, it's good. But we're not gonna shoot that up the charts. It's too, it's too much of a niche or something.

Yeah. But, and here, so here's this. Bruce Springsteen's never had a [00:20:00] number one song. Yeah. That that'll, that. That's a mind bogg way. It's So you think he, he has all these iconic songs too, in Springs dancing in the Darks is high at two. Is that right? I think so. I think so. You know, that's a really, really odd.

Really odd note. Alright, couple listening notes from me and then we'll get into some more conversation. But first, y'all know I love a good pedal tone. And this has a lot of it at the beginning, especially this, this opening guitar riff. Oh, it does. You know, it's sitting on that one and then, and the chords are moving around.

Even in the verse not so much the verse. Hold on. Where is it? In the beginning? Well, the whole guitar part, the whole acoustic part is paddled the entire thing. Yeah, pretty much. There's a couple spots in the verse where it's moving around, but then this little interlude between the first two verses where it's going,

which sounds a lot like, By the way, Swing Town, by Steve Miller. Oh, man. We talked about before. Yeah. Which was the. The musical inspiration for Crazy Train, right? Do we remember that from the Crazy Train episode? Everybody taking notes? Wait, excuse me. [00:21:00] So the, you know, you know, Swing Time on Steve Miller?

Yes. The, Okay. The D Yep. So literally Randy Rhodes was like playing that in soundcheck one day and it turned into Crazy Train that became crazy. You okay. We may need to just take a minute here. . Yeah. You could have given me a hundred songs side by side. Yeah. And gone. Which of these inspired the other, and I would've maybe guessed Slayer and.

Hansen before I would've guessed those two. One, because they don't seem like they're the same. I mean, or like Hanson. Inspiring. Slay or Retroactive. No, that's even better. Which shows the impossibility of how far, because I don't think about those two in the same time era. Right. No they're not. Yeah, but it's apparently it was.

I mean, holy cow. That makes sense. Swingtown was a few years older, you know, And the crazy twin was early, early eighties. See, I think of, yeah, I just think of Oy Osborne as like seventies, but doesn't make sense. Doesn't matter. But that [00:22:00] is fascinating. Yeah. That's cuz Black Sabbath booms, that's the tie in that you're hitting there, right?

That's exactly right. Oh, that's why. So that makes sense. That's why Yeah. I forget that was a solo thing. Yeah. Okay. So it's got those just chords moving over that little pedal tone all over the place. And another great example that that is very similar would be Dancing the Night Away by Van Halen. The

it's all moving over that one. But with those major chords moving around, that one, I just love that sound. It makes me happy. I get all open tuning a lot of times where, Definitely. Or Lord, you are good by Israel rather than you church people. Yeah. For thank you for that. Sitting over that e little shout out to Israel.

Alright. Then you've got the, just that single D note strummed after the main rift.

That like dynamics coming in soft to loud and then sometimes you get the extra like clap sound after. Yeah. Like the, Oh, that's not a clap. It's like, that is zoo's thunder. God slap . I literally started laughing out loud listening to the song going, Is that a [00:23:00] whip ? Yeah. Like, what is that? It does sound like one of those things you ever been to like a eighth grade band concert in Slay Ride and they, it's the, there's a birthday party and.

They're great. That's what it sounds like. Yeah. It's a, it's not recorded in the balls in the halls of vaha. Yes. It just feels monstrous. Yes. Because there's claps throughout the song. There's like basically a clap loop. Do you know why I read that? It was to help them keep time. Right. And he just, Said it didn't work without it.

When they took it out, took it out. He's like, Oh no. Yeah, well, it's gonna go there. What happened here? Yeah, so and so. Then they're like, Well, we need something bigger than that. Oh, yeah. You know, So then there's one, Just imagine God clapping, but again, in a stadium that he built for everyone that's ever lived.

Heaven, like the heaven after he's just washed his hands. Soapy water. Let's do this thing. I think I talk about, I think I'm in love by Jessica Simpson, right there. Yeah, sure. Why sample? Yeah. Shall we play a little [00:24:00] bit? Play a little, and the Jake Owen. That's right. Yep. Yeah. Jake Owen also has a, a Jack and Diane infused.

I don't know that a song called I was Jackie or Diane. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. I know that song. Oh, okay. That makes sense. Yeah. Let's see. There's so many. I think I'm in love. Here we go. I think I'm in love with you, Jessica Simpson Song.

Can't deny. It's still cool. It's, it's, it's gives great hook. I'm not the biggest Jessica Simpson guy, but like base sounds good. Yeah. It needed

doing the main riff really on a synth keyboard there. Okay. That's enough. Will a baseline please? You don't mind just giving me a huge baseline.

Yeah, it feels good. It feels like she was vocal coach by someone saying, Just sing Sassy . I don't even know what we're going for. Just gimme sassy. Remember that show her and Nicholas Shay was [00:25:00] everywhere. Oh man. Yeah. Oh yeah. They really, they really had a moment today. The sea. That's right. That's what it was.

That was the joke. That was good callback. Nice job, Dave. Yeah, you win. You do win. Okay. We have to talk about the eternal lyric, Maybe the greatest lyric of all time sucking on a chili dog outside the tasty freeze. Okay. I've got, I've got a take on it. Do you have something you wanna talk about? I just have a clip that I want to play.

Okay. That is from something else. So why don't you go ahead. Well, my clip is, I'm gonna play something I want, if you guys want to hear what Sucking on a chili dog. Sounds like let's play. Let's build a bridge. I don't think I by Michael English and hear the way he says the word forgotten. . So play. Let's build a bridge by Michael English.

Incredible. And the way he says the word, this is why I love this show, Forgotten, is sucking on a chili dog. . So look that song up, it'll just been like, it'll be in the first verse. So it'll be, had you just been to the dentist or something? Mouth known. This is a . You got it. It's like an album cover. Okay, here we go.

Give it a minute. Y'all know the song. What's the word I'm looking? Forgotten coming up right [00:26:00] here. Seems we for that is exactly. Suck it on a chili dog. Sounds like, I think. It sounds like being electro . One more time. One more time for the kids at home. Forgotten.

Okay. Back it up for. It's at the beginning. Here we go. Go to the very beginning. Here we go, everybody

Wow. Okay. That's it. It was like the front of his mouth disappeared in that moment and it was just all, all way lawful. So that's when you get a bubble in your mouth and you try to talk through the bubble. Yep. Sounds like that his shot collar on him. Yeah, and they just went. Wow. Shout out to Michael English.

Michael, we aren't eating until we finish this vocal. I'm so hungry. So they finish this chili dog. He took a bite of it and then he got [00:27:00] shot. Alright, I'm gonna, I'm gonna play a clip from this is Tom McGovern and he did a version of Jack and Diane, but most of the lyrics are sucking on a chili dog.

Oh my gosh.

Sucking on a chili dog. Sucking down a chili do. Sucking down a chili dog. Sucking on a chili dog . Sucking on a chili dog, Sucking on a chili. Do sucking on a chili. Do sucking on a chili dog. Hit the chorus, sucking on. Chilly do suck in on the do do chili sucky, Chilly do on the doll. Doll sucking. Oh my God's good stuff.

Oh, that is, that is, I have to say it. Take two seconds. Did y'all see the bit [00:28:00] where it's one of my favorite things that's ever happened in the universe where Jimi Fallon did with Kevin Bacon? No. With, take those old records off the shelf. All time. Rock Roll, Put 'em back on the shelf. , take that old records off the shelf.

Now put 'em back on. The whole song is those two lines. Wow. The whole song. And he and the roots do. And they, by the end of it, it's just, you're bleeding, tears, laughing. Well, him and like a Sesame Street sketch, Kevin and Kevin Bacon did the free, Fallen free Tom Petty. And all they sang about was horses.

Horses. The whole songs about horses. Second on chili dog. It's such a interesting lyric. It's a visceral line. Well, it it, I mean, not to, you know, you know, I mean, it it plays to what he's getting at. Yeah, yeah, yeah, Yeah. It really does. It's like, yeah, you, but, but it, it, I think that's one of the ma I mean, I'm not gonna skip ahead too much, but I do think that's one of the magic.

That's one of the things that's so magical about this lyric, is it really, you a [00:29:00] thousand percent know what's going on. Yeah. You know who these two characters are. He paints such a clear what each one of them want. Yeah. Why it makes the lyric so compelling, why it feels so youthful. Mm-hmm. , it's like, it's such a well done.

I think it, this is one, but that youthful line is really good. It's unbelievable. It's so, it's likes such a Tom Petty. Trick to me of like, you kind of get duped into thinking it's this kind of dummy throwaway lyric, but you start peeling back the layers and you're like, No, this is actually wildly profound and how much it's playing to what the song makes you feel.

Yeah. Setting the scene and just kind of young, foolish kids, but also the prefunded, the profundity of that chorus line, which is like, you know, the, the. Life's, what is it? I've got, Life was only even after the thrill living's gone. Yeah. Like, you know, it's just that he does such a good job of, I think if it wasn't as sharp, it wouldn't be quite as interesting.

Yeah. Like if there weren't those kind of images and explicit sort of feelings about the ham between your knees and slide those, you know, let me do [00:30:00] as Cause because you're like, well, no, it actually, that's what. That's what makes the chorus you kind of like, it's like, Oh no, that kid, or I was that kid. Or like, you know, you just feel it.

You're like, Yeah, it's evocative. It's very evocative. Mm-hmm. . Whereas the thing, if he had softened that at all, I just don't know that it would be quite as, It wouldn't make you feel like it does. Yeah. It wouldn't like jar you into imagery the way it does. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. For sure. Okay. I think the next thing we're getting to is probably the drum fill.

I'm sure we all have thoughts on the drum fill. Dave, I know you're a. You're a drummer, so I wanna get your thoughts first on this. Kenny R Off. So y'all probably have this, but I think it's just good just to read what he says. Y'all have this, Okay. I I have a quote from him on it. Okay. You should play it first and set it up and then, So this is the drum field that's gonna set up the bridge.

Here comes.

So let rock. There we go. [00:31:00] All right. That's Kitty a. , you don't need to sleep on that high hat in that breakdown either. The little choke Well, no, the, the.

So I'm just gonna read his words. It's gonna take a second, but it's really worth reading. It's good. I'm reading lot. So, Kenny Arnov in an interview with Song Facts said, I walk into the studio. This is, this is John's touring drummer and drum in the studio at the time. I walk into the studio and co-producer, and the co-producer has a Lynn, m l m one drum machine.

You wanna give 'em a quick rundown on the, on the Lynn drum machine? We did. We've talked about That's what I figured. I've talked about it way too much. I've never seen a drum machine. I'm being told that they're using this song on Jack and Diane and that we were having trouble coming up with an arrangement for it.

I'm devastated that I'm gonna be replaced by a drum machine. I grab the drum machine, I get the manual, which is actually really amazing. He did this and I re, and I programmed the drum part. Yeah. In the lounge. Really bummed out and wondering. What's the future of the drummer? There's just gotta be terrifying.

That line right there, I mean, terrifying. This is 1981. I'm wondering, will that machine replace us? Two hours later, I'm summoned into the control room where John tells me, I [00:32:00] need you to come up. So John Mellencamp, Obviously I need you to come up with a drum solo or something After the second chorus. At that moment, I was absolutely terrified and excited.

Excited because now I'm going to be playing on the record terrified because I knew that I had to save the song in order to save my career because if I didn't come up with it, they'd replace me. Two people had already been fired in the band and when I joined two years prior, I was fired from playing on a record.

So this was a scary moment for me. End of the paragraph, here we go. The long and short of it is I came up with this part on the spot and it becomes the number one John's biggest hit ever. That, and in the Air Tonight by Phil Collins are probably the two most air drumm solos on pop radio. Even Melancamp air drums it in the video.

Yeah. It's not technically hard, but I was forced to create that on the spot. I love that. Isn't that great? Yes. Yeah. You know, I think it's, I don't wanna get too far ahead, but I will say this, it takes me back. One of the thoughts that I had, I actually had a lot of thoughts about the song. One of the things that I think is really unique about this song, and it's not lost to me, that this is the same summer as Billy Jean was around.

Okay. Which to me, that record, [00:33:00] Yeah. 82 typifies this production. So Mutt Lang would go on to do this and was doing it around this time with acdc, I guess, But like, This idea that everything is very much in a place of its own. Like Billy Jean, you know, if you listen to any Quincy Jones interview about that record, same thing that Mutt Lang would go on to make famous too, which was like, everything has its place and there's no fat.

So if you're not playing a melodic part, you're not contributing. If you're not contributing, you're out. There's no just like rhythm parts that aren't a part and everything, if you listen to a thrill, Everything on that record in a song is singable. Like everything from base parts to everything's singable, right?

This song does that too. And you realize with that, like, I just love the thought that they were going, Okay, how do we create a song that is not just like guys jamming through a song, you know, like, all right, play it down. And, and, and Melanie came, actually speaks to this show, may have this he said uh, Jack and Naomi was a terrible record to make.

When I played on guitar by myself, [00:34:00] it sounded great, but I could never get the band to play along with me. That's why the arrangement's so weird. Stopping and starting. It's not very musical to translate the folk see song to big budget recording Melancamp Gayman would need play of assistance. He goes on to talk about like, You know you see one of the models for Jack and a was Phil Collins in the Ear tonight.

The producer said, John came in one day and after he sat down and played it, he said, This is what I wanna create. I wanna have a couple of verses that sound like a little folk song. Mm-hmm. . And then I want a big bombastic entrance to Johns and we'll take it to a whole new place. And so I think for me, one of the geniuses of this song, maybe as much as this is a really hot take, but maybe as much as any pop song in the history of time, in my opinion, is a.

A great example of what you can do when you go from like, I'm playing a little song on the guitar to someone going, No, we can kind of break this into a musical montage of parts that all are very, very memorable and actually take the song in a hole. Could you imagine him sitting out? In fact, if you [00:35:00] watch him, actually to this day, if you watch him play it, there's a couple of burdens.

Him playing Athar aid, he plays it like Bob Dylan would play it. Like, it's not that guitar part. It's like a three or four card, a chord song, song, you know? It's like, it's like not, but you realize every part of it you want to hear because you're so used to hearing the production. The production. Yeah. And so it's cool when you think about the drums, it just, everything about it is so thought through and, and it's cool to hear that they both, that John and the producer were both like, That is exactly what we're going for.

We wanna kind of jar you, we wanna get your attention. , but the song is still so good, you know? Yeah. So it's a really great example of when those two things kind of meet and become Absolutely. Become a bigger thing because of it. Yeah. You know? Which is so funny cause you, I couldn't, when he's like, Yeah, I wanted, I was done with it.

Like I thought the song, I wasn't gonna record it and I'm like, Number one song. How do you not record Jack and Diane? A perennial song? What would the world be with Jack and Diane? Yeah, but to hear that you know like that, that's why that drum Phil [00:36:00] felt sounds like that is cuz they wanted that drum fill to sound like that.

It wasn't like he got in there and played and they're like, Holy crap, Kenny, do that again. Yeah. It was like, No, we need it in the Air Night, Phil. In the middle of the song. Yeah. And two, how much music influences other music in the same time? I mean, really close. What was in the air tonight? 81. Want think?

Something like that. So it's like Right. Just came to y'alls point about crazy training. I mean, it's funny that. music will always be like that. It's always looking to its side to see what people are doing to influence what you're doing. Yeah, and I think it's so cool when you not cross genre, cause that's both pop, but you know, arguably rock and roll and pop with Phil and him, but that it would still be something where he comes and he goes, I'm referencing very directly this song.

Let's do something like that. Yeah. And two weeks prior to when we released this, we talked about if you go in the studio and like gimme some Nora Jonesville vibe, like that's a thing. Or on this like gimme some, you know, in the air tonight or some Jack Diane drum fill. That's kinda what we, Yeah. People know exactly what you mean.

Yeah, for sure. That's great. How many calls did Kenny ano get, by the way? From friends going, How did you get him to let you do that? Yeah. Cause the thing that's so funny about the drum field too, is it goes [00:37:00] on for what, two bars? Just drum. Yeah. I ate three bar. It's full. Three bars. I think. I mean, it's like as a drummer you are like, Here I am world and my phone is about to explode gigs.

Yeah, yeah. You know what I mean? It's absolutely. Let's meet him. Let's meet the band. Let's do this. Hey, let's meet the man. It's time to meet the band. Hey mama, let's meet the band. Let's meet the band,

right? We're gonna meet the band that played on Jack and Diane. On guitar background vocals. Larry Crane he's Mill camps guy helped identify a sound. I read somewhere. It's called Heartland Rock. Have y'all heard? That makes total sense. That's camps like Heartland Rock. He played guitar on Hurt, So good.

Pink House is small town. Play a little of, Ain't even done with the night. I sent this to you guys. This is the most un melancamp sounding song that I think is out there. But he plays guitar on this and I really like the guitar work at the beginning. What album is this on? This is on, I can see the cover.

Hold on. Yeah, I'm looking [00:38:00] at You can tell me Rob. It is on Nothing Matters. And what if it did 1980? This is Melancamp. This is Mellencamp me. So this is before, although the title sounds like Garth Brooks, but that guitar sounds like freaking nickelback. I literally, but I like it. It's better, but that's like, This is John.

It doesn't sound like 1980 gone Mellencamp. Anyway, it's true. I like this song. So he played, he played that electric part electric on that right there. Okay. So what did he play on this song? He does a lot of different, They layered. Let me get through it. Let get through all the guitar players and I'll talk to you who also on guitar.

I'm so curious for me, Mike Wayne Chick. It might be pronounced. I'm gonna go with Wayne Chick cuz I'm reading guitar and background vocals. He's played on everything pretty much Cougar as well for the past 40 plus years. He still plays the 1974 standard less Paul through a 63 Vox AC 30. There you go.

I mean that. That's the guitar and amp of that, and that's still play. He owned in Echo Park Studios where more modern, more modern artists like Howie [00:39:00] Day and Ben Folds record, he owns that. Oh wow. He owned that studio. Also owned guitar and background vocals. Mick Ronson. Worked on multiple David Bowie albums, Tumbleweed Connection for Elton John, The Busting Out album by Bruce by Pure Prairie League, which has my favorite Prairie League song on there, which is Amy.

I love that song. Yeah, he played guitar on that stuff with Bob Dylan. He died in 93, but not before leaving his mark as a legendary guitar player and not the father of Mark Ronson. Correct? Yes, that's true. Good, good call there. On drums, we already talked about Kenny Drums, Lin drum machine, and then we.

That you, you covered that wonderfully so I don't have to talk too much on him, but 17 years with John Cougar Mellon Camp. He played with him for 17 years. It's so cool that he keeps guys around that long. I love that. Also stuff with Willie Nelson, Bob Seger, John Fogarty, John Bon Jovi. So yeah, he's that guy.

Yeah, he's done, He's in chicken foot. Yeah. With when Oh wow. When do on, when Chill Pepper's drummer can, Chad Smith couldn't be there. He fills in. Modern drummer named him the number one pop rock drummer and number one five studio drummer, [00:40:00] five consecutive years. Wow. I mean, that's modern drummer and studio like Rock drummer and Studio Drummer five years in a row.

I mean, that he's number one, he's like the consummate pro for studio and life performance. Ed used him a few times, cash stuff, I mean, and said he was like, he drove through the night to do a session once. Really, He Arnold drove through the. That's correct. The guy that does not need to drive through the night to play on a session and.

That's awesome. That he was awesome. He's like, You just go. You feel if you feel he's trustworthy. Oh yeah. You go, This guy's gonna get it done. Yeah, he's gonna be solid. It's gonna be great. You know, I mean, he did the jack dye drum fill on the spot, like he'll be fine. Yeah. George Chocolate Perry plays bass on this entire album, ex, and he's a legend.

John Sakata, bgs Crosby Seals National Young. However, this track is the only track that Robert Fe Frank plays bass on. Pardon? This guy is an automotive body shop guy who owns Fe's Dent Body Shop. His favorite song isn't this one. It's a [00:41:00] song called I Need a Lover that he played on and he got his, I didn't, yeah, he got his nickname Ferd as Short for Frank Feer and hated that name.

But as he walked, is he the chili? No. And he walked across, Sorry. He walked across the stage. Everybody was chanting Ford, Ford, Ford. And he loved it, so he kept it. Wow. But he doesn't play anything else on this album other than Jack and Diane. Weird. Yeah, that's the only one he plays on, on keyboards. Eric Rosser famous for something little less glamorous.

He was on the top 10 FBI's, America's Most Wanted List in 2000. No, it was not. They found him in 2001 in Bangkok for child issues. Okay. Anyway, I'm not gonna get that whole story, but anyway, he got. And then. He, Anyway, he got arrested again later, so good Lord. He had 50 K in cash and marijuana strapped on both his legs and he got convicted in 2000 Thursday.

Anyway, there's a whole story about it. We'll leave that for another. He's like, That's just the way I work out. , raise my legs down, Right? Yeah. You're good co-writer on this Don Gibbon legend stuff with our friend [00:42:00] Sony of Hootie. Yeah. On crack review, he helped write with him. He produced a Night on the Town by Bruce Hornsby.

Love it. There's a soft spot stuff with Reem Eric Carmen and he produced Give One Reason for Tracy Chapman. Oh, wow. That's cool. So Don bringing it and guy named Dave Parman. Same background vocals on heart. So good. Only. He's on the album, so I wanna give him some credit. Okay. So that's the band. All right, let me, So who, who can we talk about that acoustic part?

Yeah. So what I was gonna try to get to tell me about that Larry, Larry plays electric mainly, but he does layer in the acoustic part. So he does both parts. So he plays the acoustic part and then does another rhythm part on guitar. The big chunky. Yeah. And then Mike is the other electric guitar player and plays guitar too.

So there's, there's actually three guitar players playing. Larry plays two parts. Mick plays and Mick and Mike each play one. Okay. So, so did you, I mean, I don't know why you know this. Do you know if he wrote that part or did John? I don't know that. I would imagine he might've, because when John plays it, he doesn't play it.

He didn't even attempt to play that. Yeah. That would be Mike. I don't think John for sure, [00:43:00] and I know Mick Ronson gets a lot of credit for this song. Yeah. And he was the one that he might, I mean, Mick Rider wrote that. . Yeah. They said they said that Mick kept pecking away the song and adding percussion and coming up with like the gang vocal section and really making he Yeah.

The gun. He gets credit for really making the song work a lot. Right. The choir part, The gun Let it rock, Let it Roll. Is the Mick Yeah. Mellencamp is on record is saying like, he basically wrote the song with me. Yeah, because before he got there, it wasn't. Yeah, so it makes me feel like he probably did a lot, you know, wouldn't shock me at all.

He's like, Hey John, you wanna send me some of them Jack's dog? Yeah, no kidding. He's like, No, but you like Corey. He's like, Well, so why don't you pay me? He's like, Yeah, not like that, but like you. Thank you for all your help. You know what? I'm gonna give you credit. Oh my gosh. But not bank credit, credit and nothing.

That's right. Let's see a little bit more on the song. Kind of, The story is loose based on a 1962 Tennessee Williams movie called Sweet Bird of Youth. And I think a great quote from Mellencamp about kind of the, the, if you had to boil down the essence of the song, he said, coming to terms with failed expectations is what counts.

And so like [00:44:00] he's basically saying that like, Life is gonna get hard. You know what I mean? And what you do is how you react to that. You know what I mean? Like, it's not gonna be perfect. Who you are is how you react when life goes bad, essentially. Mm-hmm. , let's see. Melancamp said a few years ago that the original premise was not for Jack's focus to be that he was a football star, but actually that he was African American.

Yes. Making the couple interracial. But he said the record company convinced him to leave that bit of info out. I don't know if it was for fear that like people wouldn't like the song if it was an interracial couple or that they were just saying it will be more widely. Whatever, if it's not, you know, which has always been a stupid thing to me.

Who, who cares? But anyway That was a concern as late in time as the 1980s frustrates me. Yeah. You know, like, come on, we can do better. Of all the places you'd think Mellencamp might have gone to record the American Fool album, when you think, I mean, we've said Heartland a hundred times already, right?

You would think Yeah. Anywhere but Miami, Florida. [00:45:00] Oh, wow. But that's where this album got recorded. I would've get anywhere. New York. Phoenix, wherever. Right. Any, but not Miami. But that's where, that's where this album, American Fool was recorded. Let's talk a little bit about that album. This is me Camp's fifth album.

He was 31 by this point. And you still think this is early eighties, so like, he was not a, a spring chicken at this point. Right. But this is really kind of, I mean, he'd had like, I need a lover was like 79 or something like that. But this is when he starts to become like, Oh, freaking Mellon came. He's still John Cougar at this point.

You know? So like he still had a long road ahead of him. But he was already 31. The album is five Times Platinum in the us. Dave, you know a little bit about that. US billboard number one number 18 in Australia. And and like you said, David, it was a difficult process. Like he said, Let's see, here's a quote.

Don Gayman said, We had 20 or so songs. We had a record company that was hoping we were making a Neil Diamond type album. And after we spent two or three months in the studio recording these songs and mixing them to the [00:46:00]best of our ability, I can remember an a and r guy in a pink shirt coming in to listen to them and basically thinking we had nothing.

At that point, they put a stop to the project. We had Jack and Diane, we had hand to hold onto. We had weakest moments. We had some good songs. And while I don't know the precise nature of the discussions that took place Reva went from wanting to get a new producer to not even wanting John on the label anymore easily.

Finally, they came around to letting us finish it, but wanting to hear the new songs we were gonna cut. So, which you would think after hurt so good, they're. Okay. Okay. All right. We got a couple. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, we're gonna be fine. This album's gonna live. It's gonna be fun. But whatever. Let's see. A couple random notes.

Actually, I'll save them cuz I know you have, right? Do you have a stump? The genius for us? Yeah. Let's play some Stu. Genius. Let's stump the genius. Stump the genius, stump the genius. It's time to stump the genius. Don't, and take your part. I take your part. All right guys, we're gonna play Stump the Genius. I can't wait to see this.

These songs reference either Jack and Diane or [00:47:00] names of couple. So like, they'll, they'll reference a couple. Okay. I'm gonna, y'all can combine help to get these, Okay. All right. So y'all are a team on this. I'm gonna play the song and all you gotta give is the artist. So we're gonna try to make this one the artist, artist.

I really wanted you to do something that had like, that had animals in their names. , right? Sure, yeah. Cougars and Cougar. Sorry. Sorry. I went I went couples cougars or melons, right? Oh my gosh. Oh goodness. Okay, so here we go. Is don't Google that. This is do not Google Cougars and me. That's right.

Yeah, that would be bad. You're gonna get a lot of Tiger King. Family friendly podcast. Here we go. All right, we're gonna start with this one. Just name the artist. I'm gonna give you a few seconds on it. I'll give you some time. We'll get through 'em. Here's number one,

first lyric in. This is Jack and Diane. And maybe when you hear the vocalist, you'll know him. If you don't know

[00:48:00] I, if you're gonna say one of you two would know it, I would guess Dave would know him more.

There we go. But I could not probably get this one. Come on. Of course. Billy Joel. Billy Joel's the man in from Italian restaurant. Eddie and Brenda. That's right. Brenda and Eddie. This one may be the toughest on the list. I don't know. Maybe not. I love, I love whatever this is. Yeah, do bro.

You, I'll give you the two people in it. It's called Romeo and Juliet. Oh. Oh, It's Martin Ler. Martin Knoller or, or later. And I think the version Indigo Girls Dires Strips. Huh? Do you ever hear that version? Indigo Girls version? That's the version most, I bet you most people know. Song, Song is from Princess Bride, Indigo Girl, Indigo Song.

Yeah. I dunno. It's so, Oh. Yeah. Just solo guitar, Amy. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Absolutely. That's good. I've never heard it [00:49:00] wild. Okay. Oh, come on. Benfold. Benfold. There you go. Zach and Sarah. All right, here we go. Oh, this is Katie and Johnny. Katie and Tommy. Tom. Oh my God. Love to. Who is it? Y'all know who it's, Yeah.

Trisha. Trisha Yearwood. Very good. Okay, last one, Watch. I love that song. I didn't see, and of course, Oh, Tony, and this is Johnny. Johnny B Jovi. Johnny b John Cougar. Bonjovi. That's right, Tommy. Oh my gosh. Good job guys. Y'all at six for six himself. Now ring those right, ring that bell. Rob, give yourself, Come on.

Ring those bell six ring Christmas. There you go. All right, A couple of notes before we finish up on Jack and Diane. The weird WL Yankovic song, Buckingham Blues was originally intended to be a parody of Jack and Diane. Okay. And so I don't know if you, you, I'm sure you guys are overly familiar with Buckingham Blues by Weird Al Yankovic.

I understand. We all know. [00:50:00] Weird. I yank of Buckingham Blues. Of course. But the, the opening lyric is gonna tell you a story about Chuck and Diane, couple British kids from the Palace at Buckingham. Right. And it's, and it's done in a, the way it came out is a blue song going tell you a story Hold on by Jack and Diane.

Right. But originally it was supposed to be a straight parody of Yeah. Of Jack and Diane. And he said, He called Mellencamp because he calls everybody to get permission, even though you don't have to for parody, he just does it as a courtesy. So he calls Mellencamp and Mellencamp says, Yeah, you know what?

I'm trying to sell the rights to this song, to a movie. They're supposed to make a Jack and Diane movie, and I don't wanna muck up the deal, so I don't wanna be doing the parody. And so he, then he weird out, change the song around and did something else. And then of course that Jack and Diane movie never happened.

There is later, much later a movie called Jack and Diane has nothing to do with the song or the characters or anything like that, but, But anyway, so Melancamp just basically was like, I'd rather you not, and then he just did. He didn't do it. I do have a couple of things that I wanna talk about really quickly.

Absolutely. One, did we notice the base part at the top of the [00:51:00] second chorus? No. How crazy that is. No. Let's listen. Listen to how unconventional this is. It's basically a lick for like a

bart.

He's like, I'm getting mine. Well, I. That was one of those things where he was like, No, dude. I was just making sure the tones right. That's killer, man. We're leaving that. Yeah. Okay. The other thing I wanna talk really quick about, you know me, I always wanna talk about this, how interesting the form of this it is.

That's what I was waiting for. That's what we count on. If you gave me a hundred dollars to bet on, I would've lost this bet that the only two times you hear the are the beginning. Whoa. No. So it only starts and ends the song. It doesn't connect in the middle, ends the song. Yo, So this, this song, I've never spent more time [00:52:00] on form, I think on any songs I have.

This one because it was so. Different than I thought it was. Yeah. So intro verse, which we know which has one guitar part, which is that not the, the, it's not that. Okay. Right. But yeah, the verse where he's just kinda strm. It's another verse that's version of that. It's really close to it, but it's not that.

Yeah. But it's, you know, you know. So then it does a turnaround of that. Yes. Which is down the guitar. The verses are higher on guitar. So intro verse, acoustic turnaround verse chorus, which I didn't know. This guitar part is actually the same. So it's really just the chorus over the verse. Yeah. Form chords and everything.

Yeah. Yeah. They, So, so it's weird because this is why this song is so good and tricky to me is. There's all these scene shifts that you don't know are happening, but then things are actually the same that you don't know are happening. But meaning if, again, if you'd to give me a lot of money to bet on, have gotten this wrong, The chorus and the verse are just the same thing with a new melody [00:53:00] on top of it.

Yeah. Which is weird to think about. Yeah. Cause you don't think about it being the same bed. No, no, no, no, no. Oh yeah. You're like, Oh, it cord's out there. No it doesn't. It's still doing that gingy, that little thing He's doing the verse. So intro verse, cause turnaround verse cho. Drum fell from heaven as I call it, bridge with a different drum sound than the rest of the song was really interesting.

Yeah. Cause it's so big. And then it settles back down then that acoustic turnaround again. Chorus, first verse, intro. Yeah. Wow. Or the outro. Outro thing, Intro slash outro. It is such a fascinating, Again, I think when you read his quote about the song, it really helps to understand why it's so Frankenstein and that he was like, That's exactly what we're doing, is we're just trying to create like a weird sort of like, So this layering that the guitar players are doing has me confused now because I'm like, I know that he played two an acoustic and an electric part.

Maybe he's just doubling exactly what the other one is doing. Well, and the thing that's really interesting on that last outro, which is the intro part, is he goes, you know, [00:54:00] if you listen to it, it's really subtle, but it's different. Cause in the intro he goes, he goes, he does like that hammer kind of thing on the out.

Yeah, which is really interesting. For only two times you think you'd be like, No, just play the hook. Exactly. It's already in our brain. It's like, here's, here's what we're talking about. This is jack dying. I love how gentle his voice kids do. Yeah, So he plays, Here's a little here, a little different this time.

Yeah. Hit ar. Isn't that interesting? Right? Yeah. So it's truly, if you were to get, really get down to the breath hacks about it, the actual intro only plays holy crap. It, I'm telling you, it's one of the most fascinating deep dives I've done on this truth, truthfully, on a hit where I was like, Oh, okay, is not wild.

That's really nice and you can't be like, Man, if they'd have played that one more time, it would've been a hit cuz it went to number one, . I mean, for sure. Argue with it. Be like, Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I'm [00:55:00] telling you, I would've lost that. I, I was like, for sure that part happens four times, five times, right? Cuz it's so indels in your, it's indelibly whatever in everybody's brains.

Like that song, whoever, I will say this, whoever came up with those parts, I would, I mean, you're talking about two of the most iconic guitar parts. ever. And they're in one song, . That's really amazing to think about.

And then that, there's so many, There's three. There's really three. Yeah. So, So I just, I wonder if each one now have to know That's gonna eat me a lot. I'm sorry, I didn't find that. That's got me, It's like, It's like this is a prototype. I mean, this is 82. Yeah. So now when you go into music production, you're like, where can we squeeze another hook of any kind in?

Mm-hmm. If it's a, I'll find out, I'll text. You gotta know. We'll put it on the ketchup. I gotta know. I'll, I gotta know, because again, you, you said it three. Three J.P, like three. Of the most iconic [00:56:00] American guitar parts, rock and roll guitar parts of all time. In one song. In one song. It's And on different, On different types of guitars.

Yeah. Not just electric, not just, Yeah. You know, Do you know It's like one's acoustic and really pretty. The other Darner still acoustic, but then you have that, eh, on the electric. It's really interesting. Nuts, man. What a song. What a day, What a time to be alive. . What? An episode of the Great Song Podcast with our friend Dave Barnes.

Dave, thank you so much for joining again. So we gotta say you have you are early next year doing the makeup dates for the lady A tour. That's right. The request line tour. And so can people get tickets from that on your website? Go to dave barnes.com and you get tickets to go see Dave Live with Lady A.

It's gonna be fantastic. I already had my extracted view seat last time. You were so ready. I was ready. Go. Instructed me. I went sat, I've seen Dave up. I just wanna hear, I just wanna hear it. I lean around the pole. Babe. You can say good. The things people say at my shows all the time. . Yeah. [00:57:00] Yeah. And we haven't, honestly, we haven't said congratulations on the remembering album, The Acoustic Greatest Hits album.

Which has been a big success. Hopefully I haven't seen the numbers, but like hopefully has been awesome. I'm working on my own actually. Dave Barne's parody album. Misremembering, Oh my gosh, it should be me singing live lyrics. I've got, I've got I've got I sent you guys a voice note one time of headlights.

We're gonna do that one. We're gonna do, I'm gonna do one about the time that I got Air Force Ones for Christmas. Mom gave me shoes. And you know, I got a few more in the work, so we'll see how that goes. Shoes, yeah, we'll cover that next time. Alright, we'll, we'll be back next week with another great song.

Until then, I'm Rob Bob J.P p You wanna say it? And I'm Dave. All right. Go listen to some music, .